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Dewi
617 Posts |
 Posted - 19 juin 2012 : 18:49:22
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"Sync replicates all these features..."
--> The other way around. When Siri buttons are eventually integrated in cars Apple will replicate what is already offered by Sync today.
"Ford has every interest in keeping those features in its dashboard rather than ceding them to the iPhone."
--> But they are on record as being solution-agnostic with this respect. Proof of this are multiple navigation solutions which include on-board (integrated) and off-board (Sync Services Directions or TeleNav Scout, as an example). Scout is being offered despite the potential of losing sales of integrated navigation options, because that's what some customers want. There's also no reason why any other smartphone-based navigation app or consolidated voice control app (eg. vlingo) couldn't be controlled via Sync in the future.
I think we're saying about the same thing. I realise from the PR that Ford has not signed on to rebrand their system with the addition of a Siri-branded button. That wouldn't make sense. My point was Ford doesn't have to develop an integrated Siri button as it already can utilize Sync whenever it needs to. The fact that access to the cloud is a requirement for Siri (or Scout for that matter) to even work at all is a big downside in my mind. |
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wco81
USA
222 Posts |
Posted - 19 juin 2012 : 18:56:46
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Isn't Sync a co-branded with Microsoft product?
Anyways, the car makers would like you to pony up for fancy mobile electronics built into the car. But like GPS systems, they're often overpriced and inferior.
Not to mention by the time they get out into the market, they're probably quickly outdated as mobile devices are on a blistering development path.
If a car buyer had a choice, would they pay thousands more for some tech package in a car or get the latest tablet/smart phone, which will cost them far less? They'd have to find some mounting solution but they'd get way more tech bang for the buck, just as PNDs are better values than the built-in GPS from the auto makers.
But you know some of these marques will try to market the Siri button as part of expensive tech packages, like $3 thousand or more to get GPS, bluetooth, HID and the damn Siri button. |
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offthegrid
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 19 juin 2012 : 20:40:15
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Ford loses money with Siri as the front end which is the point.
quote:
Originally posted by Dewi
"Sync replicates all these features..."
--> The other way around. When Siri buttons are eventually integrated in cars Apple will replicate what is already offered by Sync today.
"Ford has every interest in keeping those features in its dashboard rather than ceding them to the iPhone."
--> But they are on record as being solution-agnostic with this respect. Proof of this are multiple navigation solutions which include on-board (integrated) and off-board (Sync Services Directions or TeleNav Scout, as an example). Scout is being offered despite the potential of losing sales of integrated navigation options, because that's what some customers want. There's also no reason why any other smartphone-based navigation app or consolidated voice control app (eg. vlingo) couldn't be controlled via Sync in the future.
I think we're saying about the same thing. I realise from the PR that Ford has not signed on to rebrand their system with the addition of a Siri-branded button. That wouldn't make sense. My point was Ford doesn't have to develop an integrated Siri button as it already can utilize Sync whenever it needs to. The fact that access to the cloud is a requirement for Siri (or Scout for that matter) to even work at all is a big downside in my mind.
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Dewi
617 Posts |
Posted - 20 juin 2012 : 01:33:33
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Disclosure: a close relative of mine is part of Ford management (you probably guessed that already  )
I can tell you Ford doesn't think that way. They are not looking to sell $2,000 onboard navigation systems anymore. They are looking to sell $15,000-$60,000+ vehicles that customers want in a very competitive business. Whether that includes an onboard navigation system or some offboard solution (or no navigation), they are open to it.
I don't know if you are familiar with how a offboard product like Scout integrates, but if not check this out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6le6P4cHks
What irks me about the Apple announcement is the presumptuousness of it. Why would anyone implicitly commit to any particular smartphone platform for the lifespan of a vehicle. (Unless those who have already drunk apple flavored "Kool-Aid".) Smartphones are changing all the time. I wouldn't commit to one ecosystem for more than two years.
Anyway, sorry for getting a little OT. |
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Kex
USA
190 Posts |
Posted - 20 juin 2012 : 04:00:48
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I tend to agree that the "Siri button" really needs to be a user configured voice control button, which could integrate with Android voice control (and potentially others) as well. We'll see how it is implemented, but the manufacturers probably consider that the average iOS 6 user is going to have a higher net worth than the median, and is therefore worth more effort on their part. Clearly, if iOS 6 would allow an iPhone user to integrate mapping features (including the TomTom app, with IQ Routes mapping and HD Traffic) using the vehicle's display options and audio system, that would be even better. That link you posted shows how useful it is to have full integration using a phone based application.
I also wonder if any manufacturer makes much money on those expensive integrated systems, currently, despite their seemingly exorbitant pricing. |
TomTom XL 340S LIVE, GO LIVE 2535M, XL 340TM (RDS-TMC) in LA traffic
Garmin StreetPilot 2720 (worthy, but retired) |
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wco81
USA
222 Posts |
Posted - 20 juin 2012 : 04:08:28
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I was thinking more of the import brands, especially the luxury brands.
They only have inventory of cars with expensive packages and if you want built-in hands free or HID headlights, you have to get a whole tech package which includes the GPS.
Anyways, one motivation for the car makers who sign on with Apple would be that Apple does heavy advertising so they really push their brand and product names. Car buyers who have iOS devices will be aware of Siri and may be more inclined to buy a Siri-ready car than one that isn't. It would at least be an additional check box for them to tick off when appraising car features. |
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offthegrid
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 20 juin 2012 : 04:20:30
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Ford does use Sync as a lead selling point - do they not? I see it in a lot of Ford ads on tv and in print. They are using that as a selling point on those cars they want to sell. Not the only selling point but a selling point.
The Siri button is not going to be user configured because Apple wants to be the headend controlling your vehicle entertainment and nav.
So there is a battle going on for control an auto's electronics. Microsoft is with Ford and right now practically everyone else has sided with Apple apparently. Android isn't in the race yet. We are seeing the beginning of strategies being formed for the future.
The best voice recognition software will win. I've read reviews of Ford Sync and people really enjoy it and surely that will bring back customers over and over again. Along with that Ford makes a great car.
I too am getting off topic but this is enjoyable banter. |
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gpspassion
93389 Posts |
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danham
USA
7339 Posts |
Posted - 22 sept. 2012 : 19:24:13
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My son, who lives in NYC, has upgraded and says he is having no problems with Maps. My daughter, who lives in MA, is taking my advice [g] and waiting until Apple fixes Maps. The problem, from what I have read, is two-fold. First, Yelp's POIs make Garmin's look accurate and up to date [g]. They are terrible. Second, even though TomTom's underlying map data is probably OK, Apple has not done a good job of integrating it with their very pretty but complex and flawed display mechanism, hence the now infamous glitches like the Eiffel Tower looking like a Dali painting.
I'm intrigued by iOS6 for several reasons, especially crowd-sourced traffic. I use the Google map app on my iPhone 4 to check for traffic before setting off on trips and (at least when a passenger is available to push the buttons) along the way.
Apple has reportedly put its Maps team on "lockdown" until the glitches are addressed. I'm holding off on iOS6 until that happens.
-dan |
- Nüvi forum moderator -
Nüvi 760 in a '10 Jetta TDI Diesel SportWagen & zumo 660 on a BMW F800 ST
Guide to working with pre-programmed routes: >> details <<
Language Guide / US Topo / 350 & 680 / MacBook & Intel iMac with OS X & Win XP / BaseCamp / Cape Cod, MA
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Edited by - danham on 22 sept. 2012 19:26:58 |
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Kex
USA
190 Posts |
Posted - 23 sept. 2012 : 19:54:13
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I really do think the key to this is going to be how quickly Apple can upgrade the maps data, specifically POI information. How were Google maps when they first came out? Were they not using TeleAtlas or other partners for a long time in many countries? and how long did it take them to improve using customer input? It seems to me that if the customer input for corrections is handled expediently, things might look very different in six months from now.
Other complaints concern the lack of public transportation options that were available with Google. Very important, I should think, in cities like New York, London, Paris, Tokyo ...; less so in cities like Los Angeles, but still very important for tourists everywhere who don't want to rent a vehicle.
Finally, some are complaining about the loss of street view, helping to figure out what a location should look like when driving in unfamiliar areas. |
TomTom XL 340S LIVE, GO LIVE 2535M, XL 340TM (RDS-TMC) in LA traffic
Garmin StreetPilot 2720 (worthy, but retired) |
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wco81
USA
222 Posts |
Posted - 14 oct. 2012 : 06:16:42
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Just got the iPhone 5 this past week and put the navigation to the test today.
It wasn't the most toughest test, just a trip from Santa Clara valley to San Francisco for the day. I was going to use my Garmin to find off street parking in the City but I searched for parking garages and had found one with decent rates and was going to plug in the address.
Instead I said to Siri "give me directions Bartlett-Mission garage and it found it. So I just went with it. Took my Garmin but didn't turn it on. I have a car charger with USB ports so I hooked up the iPhone. Didn't have a mount so I laid it between the front seats. Turned the volume all the way up and I could hear the turn directions well enough, though there's some resonance in the speaker output.
The screen displays a zoomed in view of the immediate road with exits clearly labeled. It had some generic 3D buildings on the sides of 280 where there are some homes sparsely spaced out. On the top is the destination with the ETA. There I are buttons to end the navigation or an overview button which will zoom out to show your whole route.
You can pinch zoom the overview screen, which I think is a HUGE improvement in UI over PNDs. There is nothing like it on my Garmin. I'd have to tap the minus bottom many times and recenter it awkwardly as the sluggish redraw and poor responsiveness would make for a sluggish experience. And probably not a good idea to do while driving. I did that in Italy once to confirm the routing and set a waypoint in order to force the Garmin to reroute the way I wanted to go.
Well with the pinch zoom and the capacitive screen, the redraws are instant so you can see and change the route if necessary. I didn't try this but on the way back, while it was navigating, I asked Siri to search for restaurants from the Chipotle chain and it found four and said two were actually not far off my current route. It displayed addresses of the four along with distances. I could just tap one of them and it would reroute.
Before I had set off I actually ran the Chipotle app while I was still in San Francisco and it churned and churned and didn't return any results.
Overall the experience was good. It rerouted instantly when I missed a turn. It updated the distance to the next turn much more frequently than my Garmin. It doesn't say "recalculating" like the Garmin, just does it. Maybe it would be good if it indicated so that you know you missed the original turn.
It didn't warn me to stay in certain lanes near a major interchange like my Garmin does. In fact the Garmin goes into 3D mode and shows the signs over the lanes and indicates which lanes to stay on. iOS navigation also directed me to make a u turn at an intersection where u turn was not allowed. In fact it was at a freeway on ramp.
Otherwise I'm going to look for a mount. Specifically it has to be a mount which has to be portrait or it can rotate to portrait because the display is more useful in portrait, showing more of the route on both the navigation and overview screens.
On the way up, I had the screen on all the time and the iPhone got a little warm. But if I locked the screen, it would black out and then display the main routing screen as it gave directions. If I wanted to see the overview screen I'd have to unlock the screen.
I think the interesting test will be overseas. Would I tell Siri to look for parking nearby or pronounce foreign destination names as they'd be pronounced in English? Or would I say the foreign word for parking? |
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[TOPIC] Apple Maps GPS on iOS 6 with TomTom data
