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Jim1348
USA
518 Posts |
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gpspassion
93400 Posts |
 Posted - 07 déc. 2010 : 21:24:10
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Since it now has a logger (see below) and it geocodes pictures, it will belong in the "GPS Dataloggers and Geocoding", but moved to "news" for now ;-)
I thought we already had topics on the Sony-HX5V (my main compact camera) and the Panasonic TZ-10, it seems not.
Anyway this new Casio breaks new ground with its sensors (hence the hybrid) to track indoor movements and map display apparently. They also mention a "high sensitivity antenna ang GPS engine", I wonder if that could be the SiRFstarIV GPS Chipset that has some special geotagging features like SiRFGeoRecov to tag after the fact.
continued : the V1.01 update that was just released adds log output to a kml format, making this the first camera with a built-in GPS logger. I suppose that kml log is the combination of the raw GPS data and sensor data. |
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normanjp
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 11 déc. 2010 : 00:19:13
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I ordered this camera from Amazon and I should receive it next week. I hope that it will track my trips better than my current Garmin Oregon 400t or my trackers/loggers: the i-gotU GT-600 or the excellent Qstarz BT-Q1000eX.
From what I read on the Internet, the Hybrid GPS of the Casio Exilim EX-H20G possibly incorporates a 3-axis digital accelerometer with a 3-axis digital magnetic sensor in a single module, most probably the STMicroelectronics LIS331DLH/M/F. It comes in a package of only 5x5x1 mm and costs $2.50 for volumes in the range of 50,000 pieces - see: http://www.azonano.com/news.asp?newsID=15331
For good trips records, tracks need to be recorded at 0.5 Hz (a point every 2 seconds) or better. Unfortunately, see: http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/EXH20G/EXH20GA.HTM it seems that when the camera is off, it records a point only every 10 minutes. This is not good, if you want to upload your trips to @trip (http://www.a-trip.com) or to WikiLoc. However, as Casio was able to improve their firmware to allow the export of tracks, it is possible that Casio will allow for custom selection of the frequency of point recording and will allow export of the tracks not only to the *.kml format, but also to the *.gpx format.
In the near future, we may see a real revolution in GPS devices when they will incorporate 3-axis digital accelerometer with a 3-axis digital magnetic sensor. Problems, encountered in tunnels, under dense foliage, and in cities will finally go away.
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Edited by - normanjp on 11 déc. 2010 02:19:25 |
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gpspassion
93400 Posts |
Posted - 11 déc. 2010 : 03:34:12
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Welcome to the forums.
Nice work digging up the info, yes it doesn't sound like they're using SiRFstarIV, that was only made available in the middle of the year and thei EX-H10G prototype was shown in Janauray. It's too bad because the SiRFGeoRecov looks like a great fit for geotagging by going back to geotag the picture after it's been taken by keeping the GPS "open" and using the data recorded with the picture.
Using sensors is a good idea of course, but up to now no one's really pulled it off outside car systems with a gyro and a connection to the wheels for exact distance travelled. There have been many failed experiences in the past on PNDs (TomTom, Sony, etc...) and that was for driving a much more predictable activity than walking around ;-) Looking at the screenshots, they seem to be counting the steps, 1523 in the picture above, that looks like a lot. I wasn't expecting to see Casio pull it off versus GPS specialists like SiRF or Globallocate, but we'll see how it goes.
Saw the 10 minute reference, that's essentially "push to fix", i.e. the GPS waking up to maintain enough data to be ready when needed, there might be a setting to set the actual frequency of logging. I've only found the manual in Russian so I can't say for sure ;-) Just came across this review where they don't say much about GPS other than "GPS receiver which is pleasantly effective." so I guess they didn't find any problems using it.
Keep us posted when you get it! |
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normanjp
USA
10 Posts |
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Merel
Belgium
1 Posts |
Posted - 11 déc. 2010 : 18:53:43
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quote:
Originally posted by normanjp
I ordered this camera from Amazon and I should receive it next week... However, as Casio was able to improve their firmware to allow the export of tracks, it is possible that Casio will allow for custom selection of the frequency of point recording and will allow export of the tracks not only to the *.kml format, but also to the *.gpx format.
Thank you for this valuable information. We are looking forward to your impressions. Especially : the tracks recorded should (with a little luck) display nicely on Google Earth and Google Maps. We hope that this "first-on-the-market-camera" is doing all those features as well as proudly announced by Casio. |
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normanjp
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 11 déc. 2010 : 19:05:36
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The display of the track will depend on the frequency of recording points. If this is true that when the camera is off, the points are recorded every 10 minutes, the tracks would look quite bad, even when you hike. Other sources say that points are recorded every minute - at this frequency slow hikes would still look bad and tracks recorded when driving a car would look terribly. Nevertheless, setting the frequency is something that can be done in menus very easily. If battery would be exhausted quickly, spare batteries for the Casio Exilim EX-H20G are really cheap on Amazon.
I should post some tests next week and post the tracks on the Internet. What is your favorite website for posting GPS tracks?
If the Hybrid GPS works as advertised, this would be the best invention since sliced bread  |
Edited by - normanjp on 11 déc. 2010 19:06:46 |
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gpspassion
93400 Posts |
Posted - 13 déc. 2010 : 21:09:14
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Yes, it would certainly be a major breakthrough, I still have my doubts though, see above, but will be happy to be proven wrong ;-) I may be checking it for myself actually since my Sony HX5V broke down this week-end and I'm a bit "anxious" at no longer having my pictures geotagged automatically!
As for posting tracks, www.gpsvisualizer.com is a favorite here, it's fast and you can overlay several tracks for comparison purposes. |
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normanjp
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 13 déc. 2010 : 23:23:46
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OK - first testing report.
1. Got the camera and charged the battery - this takes about 3 hours as the NP-90 battery is quite big (3.7V, 1950 mAh = 7.3 Wh).
2. Downloaded (you need to enter the serial number to get access) the firmware revision 1.01. It allows saving the Log in *.kml format. Installed the firmware.
3. Despite the late hour and rather unusual weather for Atlanta (-6 degrees C and strong wind) I walked around my neighborhood with the camera constantly on. Snapped some pictures.
4. Saved the log and loaded it into Google Maps. I see that points are collected about every 10 seconds. I think that points where pictures were taken are shown in another color. At a glance, the track looks much better than with trackers using the MTK II or the SiRF Star III chipsets (I use QStarz BT-1000X and BT-1000eX and the i-gotU GT-600 by Mobile Action Technology. Some points are off maybe even 10 meters, but no "stars" are seen with a series of points being off in all directions. Will do a test with camera off, but this may be unusable, if the points are collected every 10 minutes. Oh, the icon showing the GPS fix takes about 3 minutes to appear.
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gpspassion
93400 Posts |
Posted - 13 déc. 2010 : 23:31:01
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Thanks for that first report, looks promising!
Are you seeing any indication that there is some AGPS data that can be transfered to the camera like for the Sony HX5V? That could help with the 3 minute time to fix, although based on the info made available by Casio, it won't be necessary after the first fix has been acquired since they are keeping the position "Live". Was the 3 minutes outdoors with a clear view of the sky?
Let us know how the pictures look too, it's a camera after all ;-)
Mine should be in on Wednesday. |
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normanjp
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 14 déc. 2010 : 01:05:43
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When I converted the *.kml track on http://www.gpsvisualizer.com, the @trip program notified me that there was no time in the track (?!?). I then turned to my trusted http://www.gpsies.com website for conversion, and the resulting track was converted perfectly. I uploaded the pictures and the track to my favorite http://www.a-trip.com website. You may view the result at: http://www.a-trip.com/tracks/view/66112
In addition, the GPSVisualizer site preserver points as waypoints that in some way messes-up the track. GPSies did a clean convertion.
Enjoy!
The camera is quite decent and was reviewed by much better reviewers than I am. |
Edited by - normanjp on 14 déc. 2010 01:06:13 |
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gpspassion
93400 Posts |
Posted - 14 déc. 2010 : 02:25:40
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Still entitles you to your opinion ;-) Pics look pretty good indeed.
On the other hand the track has quite a bit of wandering to it, especially since the environment seems to be quite favorable with little or no obstruction, a dedicated GPS logger with a SiRFstarIII or MTKv2 chipset should be able to do better than that. If you get a chance to do a comparison of several tracks recorded at the same time using gpsvisualizer.com would be great, not sure why it's losing the time in the .gpx export, but for display purposes directly on gpsvisualizer using the http://www.gpsvisualizer.com/map_input?form=google google maps module it doesn't matter. |
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normanjp
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 14 déc. 2010 : 02:30:55
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Re: gpsvisualizer
Please remember that I'm a senior citizen, albeit also well seasoned ;-) - computer user since 1974. I found that the information on how to go from the track opened in Google Earth to posting it on gpsvisualizer somewhat cryptic. Could you be so kind to post a step-by-step manual how to do this, especially with more than one track?
Thanks in advance! |
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gpspassion
93400 Posts |
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normanjp
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 14 déc. 2010 : 03:26:28
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Unfortunately, no map was shown in GPSVisualizer although I waited several minutes. When I clicked the link to the EveryTrail website, a map appeared with all points shown with pushpins as waypoints.
The stats look a bit strange, so maybe Casio has a problem with writing the log information to the *.kml file - this function was just released a few days ago. Anyway, using GPSies to convert the file to *.gpx allows me to import the track to @trip PC. I may import several tracks to a trip on http://www.a-trip.com, so I may create a comparison of at least 4 different trackers that I use. Your comparisons are very nice, but the important feature of the Casio would be to continue tracking without satellites. We shall see how this works. |
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gpspassion
93400 Posts |
Posted - 14 déc. 2010 : 04:45:05
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| Yes, that's not something "normal" trackers can do, I'd also like to see it help when the multipath problems get too sever and the position jumps around. Sorry to hear you're having trouble with gpsvisualizer.com - I just gave it a try and map appeared after a few seconds, feel free to send me your tracks on gpspassion [@] gmail.com to see if I can get it to cooperate. |
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[TOPIC] Casio EX-H20G Hybrid GPS Camera - Reviewed
